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Valencia in the Champions League.
Wednesday 12th December 2018, KO 20:00 UTC.
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raycreative
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Let's play the hypothetical game

Thu Nov 15, 2018 8:21 am

To be fair this is just for a laugh because it ain't going to happen

Let us assume there is any other person,other than Mav,who believes that the Glazers have been great for this club bringing unrivalled success whilst just taking a copper or two that any businessman would do and they deserve
Let's pretend they have not raped and pillaged this club with no regard whatsoever for this clubs history,traditions and community values

Let's pretend the Glazers have fully backed every manager without interfering through their trained monkey Woodward
Let's say that Moyes was SAF and LVG was Bobby Charlton and Jose was a joint decision of everybody else BUT Woodward and the Glazers
Let's say that our old managers insisted on bringing in knackered old shirt sellers like Falcao,Schweinsteiger,Zlatan etc and it was nothing to do with Woodward who didn't want them(FFS)
Then let us analyse where we are and what YOU would like to happen

This team is at least 3 leagues below the top clubs like Manchester City and Liverpool(probable dicking coming up soon)
I think we can all agree on that
Not too many,me included,who like the style of football being played.I however accept it is the best style for the mostly average squad we have

Jose wants to go.He has made no secret of that by constantly calling Woodward out for letting him down
So who do you want as the next manager and even more importantly who do you think might take up the poisoned chalice
Top managers are not blind and whilst top football clubs,as opposed to top business's are constantly looking for better managers ALL the top managers are aware of what has happened at this club over the last 5 or 6 years l

DDG appears very reluctant to sign his new contract
Pogba has made no secret of the fact he wants off to a football team and not a brand.His agent has been with Juventus this week who are rumoured to be giving United the choice of straight cash or cash and a player they have no use for
Martial has openly asked for a transfer
Those 3 will bring in close to £300m ad i can't see the Glazers not thinking about that although whether they will sell all 3 remains to be seen

Valencia is done
Smalling and Jones are shit and Lindelof and Bailly are extremely average
Shaw is here to stay,thank goodness
I hear they are offeringAshley Young another year.Cheap i suppose

Herrara and Mata are at the end of their contracts and are probably going to be allowed to leave
Sanchez has showed more whilst the lampost was injured but expect them to start moving him around again

The lampost is shit but nobody will take him,will they and that really just leaves Rashford
I make it therefore that we need about 8 players and a manger
What do you guys think?

Would you trust Woodward to find all the above?
Do you think there is an ambition to do the above or will they be happy in moving down the top 16 super league "Harlem Globetrotters" style league that is currently being discussed that will obviously make Manchester United no loner a Manchester club



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raycreative
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Re: Let's play the hypothetical game

Thu Nov 15, 2018 10:13 pm

anybody got an opinion??



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Sigmar
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Re: Let's play the hypothetical game

Thu Nov 15, 2018 10:49 pm

Pardon my ignorance, but to whom are you referring as 'Mav'

Firstly whether you agree with any owner taking money out of the club is irrelevant, you have to acknowledge that the Glazers have backed the managers that have been appointed, regardless of who was responsible for their appointment.

Secondly you have to assume that the club has bought the players earmarked by the managers, I'm not saying they were first choice purchases, but surely they had to be on the list ? Unless of course Ed plays FIFA in his spare time ( joke).

Thirdly and probably most importantly, if those players bought were thought to be good enough for United, why are they not performing here, that surely lies at the feet of the manager and coaches ?

You cannot go out and buy eight players, put them in a team and expect results, that is what is happening now, and we are seeing the inconsistency of that approach.
You would hope that DDG stays, and Romero is a good back up, and good enough ( normally) to give DDG a rest against weaker opposition in cup ties. If DDG goes then I don't think Romero is the standard we need long term.
Are Bailly and Lindlehoff better than Rojo, Smalling or Jones ? Personally I think they are, however of the three I think I would keep Rojo, as cover for the centre and left back position.
Young and Valencia need to go offering them new contracts does nothing for the lads in the academy, lets use some of the youth, they will play for the shirt not the cash.
I would also keep Mata and Hererra, nto so sure about Matic.
Lukaku has been a total failure, he is not our type of player, or we don't play to his strengths, saying that neither did Everton. I would go out of my way to keep Martial and offload Lukaku.
We also got the short straw in the MIki deal, I think there was more to that than was let on, in fact I know there was
I ( and there are a few more of us) am not convinced about Rashford and Lindgard, we saw the same hype with Macheda, I'm womdering if we have the highest level they are going to achieve
Pogba seems to have his mind focussed on his next hair cut , and I think people can see why Fergie didn't go chasing after him the way he went after Cantona.

My criteria for keeping or letting a player go is thinking if they could walk into the dressing room of another top team and get a place, we only have two that can do that, maybe three on a good day, DDG, Pogba and Shaw.

Who would I like to see as manager, well here's one from the left field, I'd like to see Blanc have a pop, with Cantona as his assistant, it wont happen because Eric finds it difficult to visit Old Ttrafford while the Glazers are in charge, and he certainly wouldn't work for them.

Instead of your eight I would say we need to look at possibly three, and a couple of the top academy players used, give them some experience, they with some old heads could win us a cup or two, and eventually get us back to the top in Europe.


Life is what you have to put up with when you are not dead

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raycreative
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Re: Let's play the hypothetical game

Fri Nov 16, 2018 6:15 am

General answers to your comments

1-I have to acknowledge the Glazers have backed the managers.!!!
Do i? Have they?
Of course they have spent money.But look at the players that have retired under the Glazer watch.The likes of Giggs,Scholes,The Neville's,Rio,Vidic,Carrick that have never been replaced or attempted to be replaced in an organised manner
Where did the Ronaldo money go?.Not on attempt to buy a world class winger to replace him.Please don't tell me the Glazers were happy to reinvest as opposed to keeping the cash but no manager wanted them to spend the money
Any organised team/business,call it what you like would have been ready and replacing like with like ie world class quality with world class quality
You can't do it all in one go which is why you have your top scouts out and about the world permanently.You have your relationships with other clubs permanently on a good footing
SAF had his brother in South America,permanently.He had a magnificent youth system as you are aware(that's why he suggested Moyes who had built the same at Everton) and SAF was the father figure of 99% of other managers
What do the Glazers do
Cut back on scouts expenses so they all leave.Abandon the youth development system so everybody goes to City who have a stunning academy set up
Our reserves get relegated and now play in tier 2.We get knocked out of the youth cup every year by the likes of Bury and Rotherham youth
So yes the Glazers have spent some money.They have to.As players, who are effectively stock, that makes the Glazers their fortunes come to the end they need replacing
You know like Scholes with MacTomminey and Giggs with Depay and RVN with Lukaku and Rio and Vidic with Lindelof and Bailly and Neville with a failed winger in Valencia

2 You suggest we bring through "some" academy players
Who?
Do you ever watch them.Almost nobody stands out as having a chance
We let a few go on loan and none improve enough to break into even a tea, like Crystal Palace or Fulham

3 You have mentioned 3 players that can get in any other team
I agree.You suggest DDG,Pogba and Shaw.I agree
But then you say we don't need 8 more and possibly 3 will do
In case you hadn't noticed it is a game played with 11.
City have about 15 players that could get in any team.Liverpool have about 9.Even Spurs have about 7
So why only "possibly 3"
There's sod all coming through from the kids
Or are you saying the Glazer womens team could help??
Even of the 3 you want to keep Pogba wants off and DDG won't sign his contract,indicating he wants off

Manager.Blanc is a good call.But would he come?
Wait and see because after a probable Liverpool dicking i think Jose will have had enough
The Scouse Ed whispering grass rumours(yet again) for the January transfer window won't wash imo
Of course Eric won't come
He is a football man and this is not a football club



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Sigmar
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Re: Let's play the hypothetical game

Fri Nov 16, 2018 8:27 am

The argument is that we have replaced the likes of the Scholes, Nevilles & Co, but not with the same quality they were at their peak, Smalling and Jones ( both Ferguson purchases) are nowhere near the quality of Vidic and Ferdinand, so what is their poor development down to ?
Personally I think the argument about the Ronaldo money is water under the bridge, you don't go out and buy a world class winger, the monmey has been e-invested, maybe not the day after we sold him, but it has since, you could make that argument about any player we have sold in the the the past.
Moyes has to take the blame for the failure of the scouting system, he replaced all the backroom staff, including the scouts, and what we got was Everton class players.
We took a lot of talent out of S America, and what happended to it, it failed to progress or just failed, Fergie was even quoted as saying ( not another bloody S American), you seem to forget Kleberson, the Da Silva's, Veron, Forlan, Varela,Heinze, Possebon. So to say Martin Ferguson did bugger all is a bit of a lie.
We all remember Fergies fledglings, but forget Fergies failures, the likes of Bebe, Djemba Djemba, Prunier, Veron, Forlan, the list is almost as long as his successes, the difference was he had a kanck of getting the best out of average players, Jose does not.

You cannot replace 8 players in one window, we would end up near Southampton within weeksand the way Jose spends money we would end up with another pig at a poke for £75m


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raycreative
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Re: Let's play the hypothetical game

Fri Nov 16, 2018 9:48 am

The whole argument ends with your final two sentences

You cannot turn this team round as you say in 1 transfer window
It took City 4 years of buying quality PLAYERS and blending them in and recognising mistakes
Ed just buys an odd shirt seller and builds an advertising campaign around them
Hence Schweisteriger,Ibrahimovitch,Pogba,Lukaku

If you are convinced Jose did not ask for 5 players and got none,despite not a word of denial from Woodward,of the public accusation then that is the end of the discussion

I see the same shit coming up again soon and the same “Pogbas a sod” and “how ungrateful is DDG” as the Glazers pocket 200m and try to talk Pele out of retirement



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Glorio
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Re: Let's play the hypothetical game

Fri Nov 16, 2018 9:54 am

lol...truth is I enjoy having both of you around cos I have people to discuss with - even if I don't agree with a lot of your views! :D

I'd say Blanc, Poch are two I'd like to have. I'd get in the manager, and let him buy or keep who he wants. If there are players the board would rather stay (e.g. Martial), that should be very clear before the manager signs.

If we're honest, a lot of us tend to watch the English leagues mostly, the big two clubs in Spain, and not much else.
For instance, we never considered Sarri or Emery (we assumed he only did well because he had the better squad), and it's early days, but both have lifted their teams a fair number of notches above where they were before without breaking the bank.
If I blame Ed and the board for anything, it's the employment of José. It looked a mismatch from day 1, and a short term fix, and if that's what it was, where was the long term strategy??

Another thing I believe is that Gary's rant on Sky Sports saved Jose's job


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raycreative
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Re: Let's play the hypothetical game

Sat Nov 17, 2018 7:27 am

I agree that Gary’s rant probably helped Jose as did the Juventus result
Did it save his job?We will never know
My feeling is that it didn’t and for 2 reasons
One is that to fire Jose would have cost money and with lot every pound is a prisoner and the bottom line is the only important number
Two is the question of who would have come as manager immediately.if they have a name or a plan like Carrick as temporary manager then Gary did save his job
That said Jose will go soon enough.I am told when it is mathematically impossible to finish in the top 4 is the cheapest time to let him go and I am positive he is happy to leave
Then we wait for the “proud to announce” headline followed by the futures of the important players like DDG Pogba and Martial
A new shirt seller to be signed and massive transfer rumours re the likes of Mbappe and Bale coming
Also the important 1 year extensions for Ashley Young and Herrera
And the limited availability for tickers for 2021/2022 season



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