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Short Back and Sides
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Re: When do we question Van Gaal?

Sun Apr 12, 2015 11:51 pm

I can't believe on the eve of us beating the Berties for the first time in ages we have United fans arguing about who signed herrera


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Re: When do we question Van Gaal?

Mon Apr 13, 2015 12:15 am

Relly wrote:
Mike wrote:This thread needs deleting from the internet.

Van Gaal's first season and he's beat Arsenal away, Liverpool home and away and now thumped City. We're playing some really lovely footy and this is WITHOUT his big signings.

Thank the football gods for getting rid of the Moysie One - fair play to him in spotting Mata & Herrera though.

Fantastic day, United will only get better from here on in!
Not sure why this fallacy still continues. The club was tracking Herrera for more than a year before Moyes was in charge. Basically Moyes couldn't sign anyone and the club finally said, what about this guy we are following. I mean Moyes didn't even sign him, so he has done nothing in regards to Herrera, no credit required.
True

but if Moyes had Herrera he wouldnt have benched him for 3 months


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Re: When do we question Van Gaal?

Mon Apr 13, 2015 3:28 am

Short Back and Sides wrote:I can't believe on the eve of us beating the Berties for the first time in ages we have United fans arguing about who signed herrera
So because we won a game all other discussion on the board must stop? Please let me know when I can resume normal activities.


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Re: When do we question Van Gaal?

Mon Apr 13, 2015 3:33 am

:laugh:


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Re: When do we question Van Gaal?

Mon Apr 13, 2015 3:33 am

Sandies wrote:
Relly wrote:
Mike wrote:This thread needs deleting from the internet.

Van Gaal's first season and he's beat Arsenal away, Liverpool home and away and now thumped City. We're playing some really lovely footy and this is WITHOUT his big signings.

Thank the football gods for getting rid of the Moysie One - fair play to him in spotting Mata & Herrera though.

Fantastic day, United will only get better from here on in!
Not sure why this fallacy still continues. The club was tracking Herrera for more than a year before Moyes was in charge. Basically Moyes couldn't sign anyone and the club finally said, what about this guy we are following. I mean Moyes didn't even sign him, so he has done nothing in regards to Herrera, no credit required.
True

but if Moyes had Herrera he wouldnt have benched him for 3 months
Things aren't that simple. You can't just say that Herrera deserved to play and had he then he would have played as well as he is now and we would have been a better team. You don't know why Herrera wasn't playing, you don't know whether or not its the fact that he had to fight so hard to get back into the team is the reason he is playing so well now.

When the season first started he had some really good games and some really poor games. Maybe not being picked allowed him to learn and grow and thats why he now is performing well consistently.

Life just isn't as simple as, if you change one thing it will automatically lead to the opposite result.

And yes Moyes might have played him, but since he is neither a winger or a target man you would have never known he was on the pitch with Moyes' "tactics".


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Re: When do we question Van Gaal?

Mon Apr 13, 2015 3:37 am

One last thing;

At the end of the day there are very few players at the club that you could say they didn't get a fair chance this year, most of them did. And the ones that took those chances are the ones that are playing consistently and playing well, not really sure what else you could ask for.


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Re: When do we question Van Gaal?

Mon Apr 13, 2015 10:51 am

True that, Relly.



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Re: When do we question Van Gaal?

Mon Apr 13, 2015 11:17 pm

Relly wrote:
Short Back and Sides wrote:I can't believe on the eve of us beating the Berties for the first time in ages we have United fans arguing about who signed herrera
So because we won a game all other discussion on the board must stop? Please let me know when I can resume normal activities.
I didnt say you couldnt, i just dont get your mentality. After the game all I wanted to do was go out with my mates and have a beer to toast a magnificent win. I was boarderline euphoric after the game.


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Re: When do we question Van Gaal?

Tue Apr 14, 2015 12:36 am

Short Back and Sides wrote:I can't believe on the eve of us beating the Berties for the first time in ages we have United fans arguing about who signed herrera
Two bald guys fighting over a comb.


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Re: When do we question Van Gaal?

Tue Apr 14, 2015 3:35 am

Relly wrote:
Sandies wrote:
Relly wrote: Not sure why this fallacy still continues. The club was tracking Herrera for more than a year before Moyes was in charge. Basically Moyes couldn't sign anyone and the club finally said, what about this guy we are following. I mean Moyes didn't even sign him, so he has done nothing in regards to Herrera, no credit required.
True

but if Moyes had Herrera he wouldnt have benched him for 3 months
Things aren't that simple. You can't just say that Herrera deserved to play and had he then he would have played as well as he is now and we would have been a better team. You don't know why Herrera wasn't playing, you don't know whether or not its the fact that he had to fight so hard to get back into the team is the reason he is playing so well now.

When the season first started he had some really good games and some really poor games. Maybe not being picked allowed him to learn and grow and thats why he now is performing well consistently.

Life just isn't as simple as, if you change one thing it will automatically lead to the opposite result.

And yes Moyes might have played him, but since he is neither a winger or a target man you would have never known he was on the pitch with Moyes' "tactics".
Youre right. We dont know why herrera wasnt playing
Its not like its a hindsight thing that hes playing well when given a chance and so are we

EVERYONE was crying out for change and to get him in.Its not like it was a stab in the dark attempt to fix us, wed seen his performances at the beginning of the year and were crying out for a midfielder like him

We had to sit through god awful performance after god awful performance week after week for months while RVP and Falcao were shit upfront and Rooney struggled in the midfield position we actually had a player for on the bench. Not only were we shit in games but during the game the only thing would change is that we would throw on Fellaini (your so called Moyes tactics) and Herrera and Mata would be unused subs

And as for the "Moyes tactics", weve seen more long balls, back passes and hoof fall at Fellaini this season than last


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Re: When do we question Van Gaal?

Tue Apr 14, 2015 11:59 am

Watch Neville and Carragher's coverage of Van Gaals philosophy last night and it's apparent the bloke is a superior tactical coach to Moyes. Fecking hell, Moyes is Real Sociedad manager for a reason!

He was out of his depth here. He will never ever ever ever be a big club manager. Never.



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Re: When do we question Van Gaal?

Tue Apr 14, 2015 12:19 pm

Mike wrote:Watch Neville and Carragher's coverage of Van Gaals philosophy last night and it's apparent the bloke is a superior tactical coach to Moyes. Fecking hell, Moyes is Real Sociedad manager for a reason!

He was out of his depth here. He will never ever ever ever be a big club manager. Never.
https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=920450038006814



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Re: When do we question Van Gaal?

Tue Apr 14, 2015 1:24 pm

Thats a great watch.


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Re: When do we question Van Gaal?

Tue Apr 14, 2015 11:54 pm

Not sure I like the fact that they've made our tactics plain for the world to see. That's not to say the opposition teams did not understand what we were about, they are paid tacticians anyway and they may or may not have. This just throws light on everything


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Re: When do we question Van Gaal?

Wed Apr 15, 2015 2:34 pm

Glorio wrote:Not sure I like the fact that they've made our tactics plain for the world to see. That's not to say the opposition teams did not understand what we were about, they are paid tacticians anyway and they may or may not have. This just throws light on everything
It's was very interesting to watch, but that was my exact thought. Although I am guessing are main rivals have people on their staff equally, if not smarter than those too.


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Re: When do we question Van Gaal?

Wed Apr 15, 2015 2:38 pm

OMG, Neville, what have you done?!

FFS, come on, if Gary Neville and Jamie Carragher can figure it out then I'm sure Jose Mourinho wouldn't have been too much slower on the uptake.
Relly wrote:Although I am guessing are main rivals have people on their staff equally, if not smarter than those too.
No shit? Their managers perhaps?

The Monday Night Football analysis will be Fisher Price stuff relative to what goes into a proper tactician's gameplan.


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Re: When do we question Van Gaal?

Wed Apr 15, 2015 3:07 pm

Maverick McKillshark wrote:OMG, Neville, what have you done?!

FFS, come on, if Gary Neville and Jamie Carragher can figure it out then I'm sure Jose Mourinho wouldn't have been too much slower on the uptake.
Relly wrote:Although I am guessing are main rivals have people on their staff equally, if not smarter than those too.
No shit? Their managers perhaps?

The Monday Night Football analysis will be Fisher Price stuff relative to what goes into a proper tactician's gameplan.
You would imagine so but we have played those tactics the past few weeks and not one rival could figure it out-City were either completely clueless to it or couldnt handle it......Toure was never going to be effective in that role, Aston Villa seen the problem and put two men on Fellaini which worked but unfortunlately for them we have other players that can also do damage.

Mourinho is very rarely beat tactically which makes this game intriguing - i expect he'll not want to lose so will crowd the midfield and hope Hazard does something speical


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Re: When do we question Van Gaal?

Wed Apr 15, 2015 4:22 pm

In sports nothing succeeds like sucsess and at least in the short haul there are no secerets. Take our game against Liverpool as an example; Van Gaal laided out blue print of how to beat Liverpool and the very next week Arsenal are using it. Wenger and his management team did not need television analusts to figured out how to implement a Van Gaal like game plan that would work with their player to beat Liverpool.

I can only imagine the number of hours that Mourinho and his staff have spend disecting film of our recent games to develop a game plan to nuetralize what we have been doing and what they need to do to take advantage of any of our faults. I believe that Van Gaal and his staff will be doing exactly the same thing with Chelsea's game film, this is just part of developping a game plan - not relying on a television show.


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Re: When do we question Van Gaal?

Wed Apr 15, 2015 5:10 pm

All credits to both Gary and Carra but in general, TV analyses are just good enough to impress the audience, even the fittest amongst us, but can barely improve any descent tactician's knowledge on the game, not to mention a manager at this level. I just feel happy having the chance to watch/listen to such competent and entertaining pundits like both of them. No concerns about us being exposed in any way.


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Re: When do we question Van Gaal?

Wed Apr 15, 2015 5:16 pm

Glorio wrote:Not sure I like the fact that they've made our tactics plain for the world to see. That's not to say the opposition teams did not understand what we were about, they are paid tacticians anyway and they may or may not have. This just throws light on everything
Barca and Bayern both play by his philosophy, they are 2 best teams in the world. According to Paul Breitner, this year's winner of the World Cup plays by his philosophy. Every manager knows it in detail, especially Mourinhio who learned it from LvG. What will scare the shit out of him is that we master it already.



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Re: When do we question Van Gaal?

Wed Apr 15, 2015 6:04 pm

Glorio wrote:Not sure I like the fact that they've made our tactics plain for the world to see. That's not to say the opposition teams did not understand what we were about, they are paid tacticians anyway and they may or may not have. This just throws light on everything
The philosophy has more to do with the mentality of the players than plain old tactics/formation. I recall him talking about players thinking on the pitch as opposed to playing intuitively. It takes a certain persona to create and sustain that kind of situation.


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Re: When do we question Van Gaal?

Wed Apr 15, 2015 6:06 pm

Just to add....if you look at Di Maria, he seems to be out of synch with the team not just because he's not match fit, I think he still hasn't worked out this mentality thing. He often seems to play off of the last picture in his head making him seem pathetically out of place. The game vs Liverpool was very frustrating for anyone watching him closely.


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Re: When do we question Van Gaal?

Wed Apr 15, 2015 6:54 pm

RED3bution wrote: The philosophy has more to do with the mentality of the players than plain old tactics/formation. I recall him talking about players thinking on the pitch as opposed to playing intuitively. It takes a certain persona to create and sustain that kind of situation.
I agree.

It is odd though the players who can handle it and those who can't.
There is not a more instinctive top level player in the world than Rooney, and he has made it his own.
I suspect that he would have found it much more difficult as a young man, but now he knows and does exactly what is expected on him.



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Re: When do we question Van Gaal?

Mon Apr 27, 2015 7:55 pm

He has not erned infalliable status amongst United fans.



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Re: When do we question Van Gaal?

Sun May 03, 2015 2:30 am

NOW lost 3 in row, not scored a single goal. :dance:



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